The Titanic (Guest)
on Chapter 1
Thu 19
Jul 201808:17AM UTC
Other points:
Keep in mind here are plot bombshells yet to drop. What’s going to happen when Dany finds out Jon’s true parentage and that he has a better claim to the throne than her? What’s going to happen when Jon learns Dany killed his best friend’s father and dad?
This really isn’t a love story or epic romance it’s just more of the political game the series showcases. Jon is using her to get the dragons. It’s the only thing that makes sense as bending the knee to her is ridiculous since Jon knows the northern lords will not accept her. Which is more believable, Jon the northern fool handing his kingdom over for love or Jon the cunning politician making false promises to keep his kingdom safe? Despite his strong feelings for her Jon betrayed Ygritte and I doubt her cares half as much for Dany.
In summation, the fact that you’ve all you can present is such shallow “evidence” means you (and most Jon/Dany shippers) aren’t really even watching the show. When certain theories turn out to be vindicated I hope you apologize. However, seeing as you were petty enough to write a boring multi-chapter fanfic just to try and incite some fans I doubt you’ll be that gracious.
You're trying so hard to the point where it's both funny and downright sad.
I follow a TON of Game of Thrones/A Song of Ice and Fire fan pages through Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr, etc. As I've said previously, the only group of fans who are kicking and screaming, claiming that Jon/Daenerys isn't romance, are Jonsa fans. It's the same group of fans, like you, who continue to write comments claiming they know exactly what's going to happen in Season 8 when NOBODY knows what is going to happen, and claim they have the correct interpretation of everything that goes down.
If you want to dismiss my points, that's fine I guess, but it doesn't gain you any high ground or victories and we're only going to see who's right and wrong when it comes to Season 8.
Point #1, you're just dismissing what I wrote. If Game of Thrones wanted to tell it's viewers that it's only Rhaegar and Lyanna who loved each other, why on earth did the camera cut in and out of scenes between Jon/Daenerys and Rhaegar/Lyanna? Right as Bran said "he loved her" it changed to Jon looking at Daenerys' door. As soon as Bran said "And she loved him", it immediately goes to Daenerys opening the door to look at Jon and invite him in. For what you're arguing for, it makes no sense whatsoever.
Point #2 When we saw the scene, the highlight of the scene was both of them looking at each other in each other's eyes. Stopping, and staring in their eyes, there was a pregnant pause to their lovemaking to highlight that moment. Game of Thrones in Season 1 went into detail about the moment of looking into each other's eyes, point out that it's an act of love. And let's point out the fact that it was Jon who stopped to look into her eyes. You're not going to win this argument. Now I'm a guy and I had my fair share of activities in the bedroom, I've had girlfriends, friends with benefits in college and one night stands and I'm currently engaged, I think I know the difference between sex for just pleasure only and lovemaking/passionate sex, trust me there's a noticeable different, and watching that scene of Jon and Daenerys, it's lovemaking.
Point #3 At this point this is beyond pathetic. When has it ever been in Jon's character to manipulate or deceive an ally? Or when has it ever been in his character to "use" someone? If you're going to claim Mance, that's an argument I can easily disprove. Your arguments are completely flawed, why did Jon need to "pretend" to bend the knee to Daenerys when she was already on his side? She pledged to him that they would defeat the Night King together BEFORE he told her he would bend the knee. Done, it's a wrap, move on. Why would Jon need to do anything further, it makes zero sense, he achieved his mission? Daenerys had seen the army of the dead, how serious the threat is, the threat of Cersei is tiny compared to the Night King, Cersei is irrelevant, she lost one of her children, she's pissed and she wants to kill the Night King. They needed the help of Cersei, they need the Lannister armies to fight along side them, why on earth would Jon "lie" to Cersei which would risk pissing her off(it did) and losing any chance of getting her to join them, when Daenerys is ALREADY ON HIS SIDE. You mean to tell me, that after living at the Night's Watch for several years, and now becoming King for several months, he's suddenly an expert at playing the Game of Thrones and is far smarter than Daenerys who has been ruling for several years? Your argument holds no weight, you're trying, and it's not working.
Well if we are to make a reference to the books and I don't have the exact word for word but in A Dance of Dragons, the fifth book, it shows Tyrion talking with the Fake Aegon and Tyrion is pretty convinced and tells Fake Aegon that Daenerys would fly to him and fall in love if he acted like a true scion of House Targaryen. When incest has been religiously practiced in House Targaryen, I don't think Daenerys is going to be disgusted over having sex with her nephew. And we have seen Jon make it clear many times he doesn't want to be King, so I can't see Daenerys seeing Jon as a threat when he has no desire to become King.
Your point of them riding North together instead of Daenerys riding on her dragons can easily be disproved. For starters Sansa already knows Jon bent the knee to Daenerys, do you recall her receiving a raven and her discussion with Baelish? Baelish, "I can't believe he would surrender the Northern crown", Sansa, "This is his hand writing, his signature, he pledged to fight for Daenerys Targaryen, he bent the knee". It can't get anymore clearer than that. When Jon told the Northern Lords, the Lords and Knights of the Vale that he was going to meet with Daenerys, they erupted in shock and outage over the decision, telling him that "a Targaryen cannot be trusted", "it's a trap" "have you forgotten what happened to your grandfather?". It's pretty much set in stone at this point that the North hates and distrusts that Targaryens, the only way to avoid bloodshed upon meeting is for Jon to introduce their new allies. If Daenerys rode in on her dragons, the North would open fire with arrows and shoot at her and her dragons, which would prompt her dragons getting pissed off, then fire, then death. I think it's safe to say they need every man they can get when it comes to the threat of the Night King and I'm certain killing Northerners would only further the mistrust and hatred of the Targaryens.
Sam hated his father and he didn't get along with his brother. His father threatened to kill him and took away his birthright, he made Sam join the wall or die by his own hands. I hope you're aware of what the Night's Watch is, it's a cold a miserable place where you are to live out the rest of your days until you die of old age, natural causes or by the blade of an enemy. You cannot have any wife, children, you can never leave, if you do leave without permission, you'll be hunted down until captured and then executed. Lord Tarly bullied and insulted Sam when Sam was temporarily visiting Hornhill. It pissed off Sam and Sam stole their ancestral sword Heartsbane, a Valyrian Steel sword, I would find it incredibly hard to believe that Sam would be angry over the deaths of two men who bullied and made him feel worthless, and kicked him out of their family. It's plausible that Daenerys would like and enjoy Sam as a friend, treat him kindly and with respect unlike his father, and name him the head of House Tarly.
The relationship of Jon/Ygritte was flawed and toxic just as was the relationship of Drogo/Daenerys. Jon was a principled man of honor whereas Ygritte was not, seeing as he was lied to his entire life and stuck in the hell hole called the Night's Watch, I can't really blame him to tasting a bit of freedom and like moth(Jon) to a flame(Ygritte), Jon dove head first into the inferno, he was freed by her death. Seeing it as his first "love", it's hard to understand what feelings you have when you're experiencing it for the first time, I saw a lot of confliction in Jon when it came to her, Olly(before he turned to shit) was a wingman by killing her. Daenerys was a young teen who was forcibly married off to a savage in exchange for an army, she was raped many time and developed Stockholm syndrome she was freed by his death. Being trapped in a mental disorder were she was in love with a man who raped her repetitively, it's a bit hard to get out of that, unless you are separated from said man. Aside from cursing her with barrenness(up for debate), I never saw "the witch" as evil, but rather a woman getting revenge against an evil man like Drogo.
Jon tasted his freedom but realized the leaders(Mance Raydar) of the Wildlings intentions. The Wildlings joined together to break through the wall and invade Westeros, the same Wildlings who have an extended history of raping and killing innocents, as an honorable and principled man, do you honestly expect Jon to stand by a woman who is firmly on the side of Mance? No and of course he left her to go back to the wall. Did he have feelings for her? Sure, as I said, it's complicated in my eyes but I never saw it lasting or healing considering how Ygritte tried killing Jon multiple times since he left. Over time, I believe Jon looked back at that and realized it was just a fling. When it comes to Daenerys, she was freed of Drogo due to his death, over time I think she looks back at her marriage and sees it for what it truly was, a forced marriage and rape, and when you consider her taking a lover named Daario, I think she moved on rather quickly.
When it comes to Jon and Daenerys, I suggest you watch this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzdMrTRplLg
And I also recommend this video where Kit Harrington confirms it's romance. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MIoIbkaZIw Kit aka Jon - "I think they(Jon/Daenerys) both know it's wrong, I think they both know it's going to cause problems, but it's that thing, when you suddenly feel that deeply about someone, and you go through those events together, its like a runaway train, you can't stop it from happening. It even Peter aka Tyrion giving his take on it, and based on his answer, I'm not buying your argument that his disappointment and worry/realization is over "Jon using Daenerys". By the way, it was Jorah who objected to Daenerys going with Jon North, not Jorah and Tyrion, Tyrion said nothing, so that's a small lie.
You won't be getting an apology from me. Jonsa fans, such as you are very annoying, this story was created due to my annoyance to you Jonsa fans intentionally mistaggaing stories to where Jonsa stories pop up in Jonerys. Once again, you are acting as if you know with 100% certainty what is going to happen in the next season, when the fact of the matter is, NO ONE does(with the exception of the Game of Thrones cast and crew). And once again, without fail, you(Jonsa fans never do) have not explained how Jon/Sansa is legitimate, you people avoid that question like the plague. At what point from Season 6 through Season 7 has there been any implication of a legitimate romance or at the very least a romance brewing between Jon and Sansa to where you're convinced Jon and Sansa are in love and will be together in Season 8. I'm still waiting for an answer/explanation and at this point I think it's safe to say I'll still be waiting.
I'm done arguing with you and your flawed sad arguments. Bye.
The Titanic (Guest)
on Chapter 1
Thu 16
May 201907:53PM UTC
I thought it best to respond before the finale airs. Let me point out that in all my comments here I’ve never once mentioned Jonsa. You kept trying to paint me as a delusional shipper but the Political Jon Theory I laid out for you was always separate from that. The only deluded ones were you and all the Jonerys Stans who refused to see the truth:
JON WAS USING DANY TO GET HER DRAGONS AND ARMIES TO NORTH. HE NEVER LOVED HER AND WAS IN CONSTANT FEAR OF HER. ALSO, SHE WAS ALWAYS GOING TO BECOME A VILLAIN!
And the stupidity continues with you. You have some balls to come writing your cocky comment full of pure ignorance.
"best to respond before the finale airs". Well that aged pretty badly moron. If you watched the finale, then you watched the scene between Jon and Tyrion's conversation in prison. It was made pretty damn clear that Jon did in fact love Daenerys. From Episode 1 through Episode 6, we've seen demonstrably evidence that Jon loved Daenerys. And even Jon was quite emotionally hurt when he had to kill Daenerys because he knew she was going mad.
Your argument of Jon was "using" Daenerys is 100% laughable. If that was the case, why wasn't there any dialog between him and Sansa&Arya to reassure them that this was all a part of his plan? There was no such dialog, nor was there any hints of clues to support that. Instead of such dialog or clues, we've seen plenty of scenes of Jon defending Daenerys against Sansa and Arya's objections in private, especially before he decided he felt the need to tell them of his identity.
No shit sherlock, Jon and the North needed Daenerys' alliance, otherwise they would've been fucked beyond belief. No way in hell did the North alone stand a chance against the Night King, they've been severely weakened from Robb's war and retaking Winterfell from Ramsey. They needed the extra man power, they needed dragons, and they needed Dragonglass, something Daenerys all had. And if you remember anything from Season 7, Daenerys promised to help defeat the Night King, before Jon decided to bend the knee to her. So yes, Jon went out and got an ally in Daenerys Targaryen and a romance also brewed between the two, and Jon believed in Daenerys. He believed in her, he stayed by her side, he defended her, he silenced his cousins in the war meeting to tell that the Northern armies would travel down South to help Daenerys against Cersei. If he was in fear of Daenerys, he certainly never showed it when he went to Dragonstone in Season 7 and argued against her. He never showed it when he rode Rhaegal. He never showed it when unfortunately had to go to her to stop her. So your argument that he used her is pathetic and far reaching.
And you can quite frankly piss off, I have the history of comment notifications in my email, you're definitely a Jonsa fan. You explicitly came after this story when others, including yourself, weren't pleased over my intentional mistagging to display the hypocrisy of Jonsa fans mistagging their stories.
Congrats, you were correct. Season 8 was by far the worst season out of all 8 seasons. The number of episodes and length of each episodes was greatly disappointing. 7 Seasons worth of character development went right out the window and into the garbage can. The writing was piss poor and the directors proved to be massively incompetent. It felt and was definitely rushed. Certain story lines with specific characters didn't make sense at all, just so it can fit the producer's narractive. So congrats, you were right about Daenerys going mad thanks to the incompetence of producers and writers who completely botched this last season. And if you even dare to argue against these points, a petition that started off with the goal of just 20,000 thousand and now currently has 1,619,643 million signatures(Still growing), would disagree with you. The petition was created to have HBO remake Season 8 of Game of Thrones with "competent writers". While it is most definitely highly impossible to expect HBO to redo the final season of Game of Thrones, it certainly sends a message that doesn't look good for D&D, in fact to further prove that point, there's another petition recently created by George RR Martin(Don't know if this is actually him)(If not, likely a Star Wars fan)(Which would only further prove my point if other franchise don't want D&D) to keep D&D away from the Star Wars franchise, it has 30,000+ and growing.
Have fun in fantasy land. Congrats, Daenerys went mad. Jonerys did happen. Jonsa never happened. Have a nice day, it'd be pretty nice if I didn't have to deal with more of your stupidity moving forward.
Comment on Winter Proposals
The Titanic (Guest) on Chapter 1 Thu 19 Jul 2018 08:17AM UTC
Comment Actions
House_Hornwood on Chapter 1 Fri 20 Jul 2018 04:36AM UTC
Comment Actions
House_Hornwood on Chapter 1 Fri 20 Jul 2018 05:14AM UTC
Comment Actions
House_Hornwood on Chapter 1 Fri 20 Jul 2018 05:40AM UTC
Comment Actions
The Titanic (Guest) on Chapter 1 Thu 16 May 2019 07:53PM UTC
Comment Actions
House_Hornwood on Chapter 1 Tue 04 Jun 2019 05:00AM UTC
Comment Actions